Curb the Parking cheaters
Why don't you figure out ways to monitor the abuse of the carpool and handicap spaces? I commute from the Pittsburg/Gunpoint station and am floored that there are so many handicap people east of North Concord. Of course Joel Keller will have you believe that it is impossible to enforce. I have offered numerous suggestions and have been told why that won't work rather than trying to come up with a scenario that WILL work. Perhaps if Joel used the station and commuted with a co-worker only to find all of the carpool spaces taken by cheaters would he make this topic a concern....
Bart needs more parking!
Bart needs more parking! Management - find a way to provide more parking. Think how many more people could take Bart during the workday if they actually had somewhere to park. There has to be a way. I have said this before - if they take the profit earned from paking fees, and placed it in a separate account , that money could be used to pay for new lots. Then, more people would use Bart, and Bart would make more money. More riders equals more money.
Are the carpool spaces at
Are the carpool spaces at the Pittsburg station still free? That might be one way to encourage carpooling at other stations where passengers are being charged for parking. It might increase ridership and reduce the frustration of trying to find a parking space.
BART Police could pay a surprise visit to the parking lot and verify that someone parking in the disabled space is actually the person who owns the placard. I remember some sort of surprise check that was filmed for one of the evening news reports in an effort to reduce the abuse. Seems they found people using placards of deceased relatives and others who were using the placard of a person who was not in the vehicle. A few stiff fines might just open up a few more spaces.
I have a disabled placard in my car for my mother. I take her to her medical appointments and to run errands. I only use the placard when she is in the vehicle with me because it's my understanding that I could be cited otherwise.
Your idea that you could be
Your idea that you could be cited should NOT be your main inclination not to use the placard. You shouldn´t use the placard because it´s morally WRONG.
i think you are being a bit
i think you are being a bit nit picky...
Yes, a majority of the
Yes, a majority of the spaces at the Pittsburg/Gunpoint station are free. The exception is the monthly pay to park lot. The handicap lot is already over-flowing by the time I get there at 7:30AM-8:00AM. We are talking in excess of 60+ spaces! Abuse is an understatement. Why am I pissed of you say...becaue when I get there in the morning to get a carpool space, and the spaces are all full, and I can easily point out a half dozen known cheaters of whom I see on a daily basis, it really sucks. I have to get back on the freeway and drive to the next station. Random enforcement before 10Am would curb this behavior. Cheaters should have their passes revoked for one year. A second violation would be a lifetime ban. And yes, you can look up those handicap placards and see who it is assigned to.
Like your solution. First
Like your solution. First time a ticket. Second time, revoke for one year, third time, lifetime ban.
I agree with all. My sister
I agree with all. My sister has 2 handicap placards for our parents. I personally know my sister and her kids use the placard even though the parents aren't in the vehicle. I told them that she is abusing it just to get a parking spot at a grocery store or even BART. It sucks to know when she said "why not" everyone else who has a placard is abusing it. She says that she notices about 90% abuse it. I don't agree with my sister abusing it but it does occur alot more that people realize.
Next time you see a person pull up on a Blue space, observe if the person who is actually in need of the close parking space is gets out of the car, mostly likely you won't see that person.
If you feel strongly enough
If you feel strongly enough to discuss this matter in a private forum, please, place an anonymous phone call to your local parking enforcment personnel. Or, better yet, the DMV. See what they advise you do about that situation... Worth a shot.
Well first of all, I HAVE
Well first of all, I HAVE contacted BART; not once but on numerous occasions for this same issue. The crap I get from Joel Keller is "we don't have the personnel to monitor all of the stations all of the time." Well, if he really LISTENED to what I was saying, I am ONLY asking you to monitor the stations between 6AM and 10AM when people cheat. If you can't do it every day at all stations, no problem, rotate your personnel, that way, the cheaters don't know which day they can cheat and which days they can't. DUH I spoke with one of the officers at Pitts/Baypt this AM. Her response was. "did you talk with mgmt." When I told her I have, I asked why was she at the station and just now (8AM) going out to check on the lot when it was already full with cheaters. She replied, "what can I do?" How about your f*cking job! for starters. Playing pattycake in the agent booth prior to 8AM does not alleviate the problem. If you are at the station, why aren't you monitoring the lot? Hello...
If true, this is typical of
If true, this is typical of what is wrong with BART in a big way. As far as the rules go, they just don't seem to get that some enforcement presence is needed so that things do not go down into the toilet, further. You're right, it's not 100% enforcement that is needed, just random enforcement so that some people are caught and punished and will thus set an example so others will follow the rules. It's basic common sense, guess that's why BART won't do it. I know, raise the fares, pay the employees more, that's the real answer. Hardly. What they need are people who will do their jobs from the top down.
Parking is enforced
Parking is enforced everyday. But why are you getting so mad at the parking enforcement people and not at the people who are cheating the system? I know that if the parking people had their way there would only be handicap and regular parking, none of this reserved and carpool stuff.
Obviously you have a
Obviously you have a distorted grasp of reality. Even BART mgmt will tell you that they do not have the personnel to enforce parking everyday. And believe me, if it WAS being enforced, then you could not stand in the car pool lot on ANY given day and count the number of car pool cheats on a regualr basis. Try it. As far as getting mad at the CTO's, it is their job to enforce the regulations, therefore, I am mad that they do not do their job. Believe me, I am ticked off at the people who cheat as well, but, with no authority to expel them from the lot, revoke their car pool tags, etc. what's the point.
Parking is enforced every
Parking is enforced every day. This does not mean that every violation is caught every day. The CHP writes speeding tickets every day, but they don't catch every speeder. For the area you are talking about, BART has one CSO to cover two stations. It is not her fault that she can't be at two stations at once. It is also not her fault that BART sets the CSO's hours so that by the time they start work, the end of line stations like Pittsburg are almost full.
CSO's are civilians and
CSO's are civilians and cannot cite people for incorrect use of placards, only an officer can. The only thing CSO's can cite for regarding handicap spots is if a placard is not displayed at all, or if a temporary (red) placard has expired.
This place kills me. You want officers in the lots protecting your vehicles, but then you bitch about officers not being there to cite fare evaders. There are only so many officers who are spread out over more than one station. They can't be everywhere at once.
Agreed, they cannot be
Agreed, they cannot be everywhere at once. I would argue that bart police catch a higher percentage of wrongdoers (is that a word?) than regular cops. look how many speeders go un-ticketed. there is not a day that goes by where i do not break the speed limit by at least 10 mph, yet i only have one speeding ticket in the last 10 years. on the flip side, i have forgotten to enter my stall number at bart twice in the last 2 years, and have been ticketed both times.
That's because CSO's wrote
That's because CSO's wrote you a ticket, not a sworn officer. There's a difference, which is what I was trying to explain.
The officer in question,
The officer in question, while I have a gut feeling I know who she is, and I do NOT like her, did her job. Very true, she dosn´t get paid to shoot the shit with the agent for hours on end, but she does, and will continue to do so until they disband that horrible police union.
That aside, the reason she couldn´t act on it is because she can´t just go off of hearsay.
Let´s say I don´t like you for whatever reason. Let´s say your stupid kid threw a baseball and broke my window. You refused to pay for it. Thus, I have a vendetta against you.
So I see your car parked at the Pittsburg/Gunpoint parking lot, and I see nice friendly Officer ____. I walk up to her and go, ¨Hey, copper! She didn´t carpool! She cheated! I saw her!¨
But since Good Ole´Copper didn´t SEE the crime being commited, and I don´t wanna stick around to file a complaint (which, I should add, is only a complaint and wouldnt end up in any formal action being taken), she is thus powerless to act.
So, unless you´re willing to take a stand and do what´s necessary, don´t whine. Plus, if you really talked to her the way you did, you´re lucky you didn´t get a face full of mace and a trip to John George.
PPIDMW
Excuse me, but how is it
Excuse me, but how is it that she did her job? She was AT her job, she did not DO her job. Furthermore, I never asked anyone to write a ticket based on MY OBSERVATION, I only asked why they were not patroling the lots as I keep seeing the same cheaters every day. I never told her to write anyone a ticket! Before you go running off at the mouth, perhaps you should read what is posted. And I don't know what totalitarian society you grew up in, but, when people of authority become unapproachable to the common man, that is when you have abuse of power. Nothing I said to her warranted mace or any other use of force.
First off, don´t be a smart
First off, don´t be a smart ass. That´s not the way to get something done. Second off, she was doing her job. She was at the station and patrolling it. Now shooting the shit with the agent is not doing her job. Watching for fare evaders and other nefarious characters is.
I was being sarcastic when I said mace you, of course she wouldn´t. But how has she become unapproachable? BART Police´s number one priority is CTA: Cover their asses.
PPIDMW
Look who is calling the
Look who is calling the kettle black! The first "smart ass" comments emmitted from your keyboard, not mine. Playing "pattycake" with the agents who are also sitting on their asses in a BART booth doing ABSOLUTELY nothing is not doing her job. Obviously your definition of work and mine are two very different things. Let me guess, you work for CALTRANS and you hold the shovel? Better yet, you are management and you stand around with two other managers watching someone else hold the shovel. The person in question was NOT a BART police, she is parking patrol (or whatver). And in all the years I have been using the Pitts/Baypoint station, I have never seen someone drive their car over the catwalk to the fare gates. Therefore, sitting in the booth, is DEFINITELY NOT doing their job no matter how you slice it. Furthermore, I never stated that she was unapporachable, but rather, when you can not approach these people to voice your concerns than there is a problem. You spouted off about the mace and from what I gather a reference to a jail or prison. You are obviously speaking from experience(s) from which I don't share.
hey no need for racist
hey no need for racist comments
And where in my rant is
And where in my rant is there ANYTHING that deals with Race? Please point it out and I will be happy to eat crow. Otherwise STFU.
Even better, find some local
Even better, find some local disability advocate group that is willing to do a study and fund targeted enforcement for Handicapped Parking offenders. Money talks, and there just isn't any extra money lying around BART to fund this sort of thing.
Thank you. Not to mention,
Thank you. Not to mention, BART is losing out with Carpool cheaters. Two occupants in one car equals two fares. BART cries and cries about no money for this and no money for that yet thay fail to maximize the ridership they have. Carpool cheats, fare evaders, these are just but two examples of revenue they are losing out on because they are too busy whining and not fixing the issue(s).
If there was enough public
If there was enough public outcry, a station should be targeted and a camera crew should follow a police officer on a handicap placard contact. The DMV laws require that registration information reflect the individual assigned to the placard. If the person contacted isn't, the placard is confiscated and issued a citation. It should be done in front of news cameras. Maybe it would be a hit on NBC - "To Catch a Handicapped Parking Scofflaw!"
In all seriousness, I think
In all seriousness, I think this is an excellent idea. BART would certainly make points with the truly disabled who need that close-in parking. BART would be performing a community service by getting these cheats out of the disabled parking spaces.
Perhaps all that needs to be done is to contact advocates for the disabled and have them bombard BART management, or BART Police, with letters and phone calls until they do something about it.
That's what this forum is for. To get issues like this resolved.
Just because someone does
Just because someone does not appear to be disabled does not mean they are not disabled. Not all disablities involve wheelchairs and canes. You can get in a lot of trouble demanding that someone prove to you they are disabled, and it's illegal if you represent an agency or even a private business.
Your sister who abuses her placard should know that the fine is the least of her worries. DMV will pull the placard and your mother will have to hike around to get to her destination from the car just like the able bodied.
There was a news story a couple years ago about placard abuse in Oakland around the federal and state buildings. They caught a bunch of able bodied people using them. There was another story that focused on the SF Hall of Justice area. There is lots of abuse. Then there are the assholes who just park in disabled slots without a placard and don't even pretend to care.
Whoever suggested calling DMV has a good idea. I know someone who abused the placard (it was for transporting a disabled relative) and it was cancelled by the DMV. The relative was severly disabled, too.
You sound like BART when you
You sound like BART when you expunge the same garbage, "just because one doesn't look handicapped, doesn't mean they aren't disabled." I am sick of hearing excuses. Nobody is asking anyone to demand proof of a disability. But, law enforcement can absolutely validate the placard against the driver. (I mentioned this to Joel Keller as well and got the proverbial HANDJOB) If the driver does not fit the description, it is pretty much a no brainer. If I was disabled, I would absolutely be pissed off that I have to park in the back of the lot becasue all of the close spaces are taken up by CHEATIN' ASSHOLES.
Hey, people can be mentally
Hey, people can be mentally disabled. With all of those remarks that you made, I´m guessing if we got you tested you would probably earn a placard too! Good job!
Face it, whoever posted about just becasue they don´t ¨look disabled¨ dosn´t mean they´re not was right on the money. Why are you getting butthurt about it? You say you´re sick of excuses, well yeah, I´m sick of hearing you. Go somewhere and bitch to people AFTER you´ve researched your facts.
But let me help you. For starters, I suggest looking up the Americans with Disabilities Act. That should really enlighten you. Secondly, do a lil Google search (http://google.com) and research disabilities. I´m sure you´ll find that many have no outward ¨signs¨and thus are undetectable, but the patients still suffer nonetheless. And jerkoffs like you don´t make it any easier.
PPIDMW
Here is yet ANOTHER example
Here is yet ANOTHER example of your inability to read a posting or postings and comment on them with any relative thoughts. Again, I stated that the placard needed to match the person, nothing about outward signs of disability, etc. I am well aware that there are people who are disabled that show no outward signs. HELLO? READ MY POSTING AGAIN. So, you don't want to read my complaints, don't log on to this site. This is BARTRAGE. You are probably one of those people who think the rules don't apply to themselves and f*ck everyone over on a daily basis just to fulfill your self-centered philosophies. But I am sure you go to church every Sunday and ask Jesus for forgiveness.
And if they were mentally
And if they were mentally disabled they wouldn't be driving - idiot.
Of course, you are probably the exception.
hey i think i barted your
hey i think i barted your the only one on here throwing insults... grow up
Perhaps you went to the same
Perhaps you went to the same remedial school that the other respondent went to? Both of you could use a few leasons on reading AND comprehension,
Mentally disabled and
Mentally disabled and mentally challenged are two different things. Mental illness is considered a disablity. Depression is a mental illness. Many people who suffer from depression drive. There are a number of mental illnesses that would not prevent the sufferer from driving. However, that same illness might cause the person anxiety if he/she had to walk from the far end of the parking lot to the station.
I know several mentally challenged people who drive. They passed the written and driving exams and are considered legally licensed by the State of California.
BART Police did check the
BART Police did check the handicapped permits at the Pittsburg and North Concord stations last year. All but one of them were legit and that one person got cited. Maybe some of these people do not deserve permits, but DMV gave them one, and BART can't do anything about that.
BULLSHIT
BULLSHIT
So you say. I guess that
So you say. I guess that makes it true. You sound like someone who got a ticket and is now pissed off because someone is getting away with something after you got caught. Get a life.
and pigs can fly...
and pigs can fly...
Hey BARTed, do us all a
Hey BARTed, do us all a favor and condense your nonsense into one post... not five of them. Thanks!
my apologies, i forgot you
my apologies, i forgot you are mentally challenged
Perhaps you can polish your
Perhaps you can polish your skills on another discussion forum since this one seems a little out of your league.
i count seven
i count seven
double or nothing?
double or nothing?
Speed Demons . . . . . .
Speed Demons . . .
. . . Besides parking violations, speed demons who practically run over pedestrians and blow stop signs need to be "curbed"!